This is something I noticed with our toddlers. If they are watching something on mom's phone they will stay engrossed basically as long as we let them, regardless of who or what is around them. But if we put the same exact thing on a big TV and make them sit 3-4 meters away from it, often their attention will (eventually) wander away and they'll start playing on the various toys in the room.
My theory was that the phone/tablet device is so close it occupies all of our vision. Plus our eyes are focused on something close to us, so looking at something else requires that momentary refocusing of our lenses. We basically have tunnel vision on the device. But, assuming we're sitting at a normal distance from the TV, there's just a lot more stuff in our peripheral vision and we're not in quite the same zombie-watching state.
This is fascinating. I will have to read through some of these articles - I'm a teacher (1st and 2nd grade) and after we went 1-to-1 devices last year I noticed kids were getting to afternoon and were just fried. Unable to concentrate, whiny, not retaining anything. They acted like I feel when I've had too much phone time - so I tried reducing their interactive tech time to a maximum of 30 minutes a day (still not ideal, I know, but it was something). WOW what a difference! They were way more engaged, complained less, and were able to work through lessons with me again. Too bad I finished my Master's or it would have made a fascinating research project!
My district is also 1 to 1 and I really struggle with how much we’re told to limit paper, printing, book requests, etc bc we’ve “invested so much in technology.”
Yes! Last year I added paper to my school supply list because folks were complaining about printer usage - like, I teach littles. They should NOT be using screens instead of paper for everything! 😐
While I mostly agree with the sentiment here, I would also urge you not to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Yes, in our current digital ecosystem the vast majority of interactivity is "bad" for us--compulsive, addictive, hyperarousing, psychologically manipulative, etc. But that doesn't mean *all* interactivity is bad. There are some important things that interactivity gets us that you don't get in passive media.
'Play' is one of the things that interactive media like videogames offer. It's about creating a space within which to experiment, a sandbox to explore ideas. Of course we should prioritize real world play far above digital play, but it's important to note there are ways to play and explore ideas in videogames that are not possible in the real world. For example, exploring the consequences of being able to rewind time (Braid), or what it feels like to be a flower petal in the wind (Flower). Writers/researchers such as Peter Gray and Jane McGonigal go far more in depth on play.
'Systems thinking' is another important aspect of interactivity. We live in a world increasingly driven by systems so it's more important than ever that the humans we raise up can understand these systems. Videogames and other interactive tools, at their best, let you immerse yourself in these systems, play with them, and really form a fundamental understanding of them. Reading a book about a system, while informative, can't give you that firsthand knowledge of how it really works. This is everything from "how does a city work?" to "why is this particular strain of covid particularly dangerous?"
Again, I agree that most interactive media on the menu these days is pretty deleterious. It's like there's a slot machine strapped to your school desk. But maybe it helps to see interactive media through the lens of being a tool. As with any tool, it helps to know what it is good for. Maybe we've just been using the wrong end of the hammer.
This was fascinating! I’m more relaxed about tv time in our house than you are, but have really avoided individual devices of any kind/gaming/youtube. My kids have to sit and watch a show or movie and agree together on what they will watch. I think it teaches them to be patient and considerate and take turns. During the school year we have no screens during the week and probably 2 hours/day on weekend. Summer is a bit more relaxed but they have plenty of off screen time sailing, swimming, reading and engaging in imaginative play. Loved your book and love you Substack!
Thanks for sharing this! My son is 4 and doesn’t do tablets or smartphones at all, but I’m wondering how to get around this once he starts school? Do you have any advice there, since they seem to unfortunately be so ubiquitous and are classified as a “learning” tool, even in elementary school?
Hi Stephanie. I think about this every fall as my kids head back to public school! I inform all teachers of my approach and ask that they please try to minimize my kids' screen time. Then I request that they not be allowed on the iPad during free time. I realize I have limited control when it comes to school, since I'm choosing to send them there as opposed to homeschooling. That's why it is more important than ever to limit screens at home (which it sounds like you're already doing).
Thanks for this article- do you consider looking at photos of family as interactive screentime if on a personal device? My 2 year old daughter likes when we look through photos of our family and also some extended family on phone- we narrate and go through who is who. I am wondering if this would also be considered damaging? Or is a lesser issue?
Hi Ashley! My non-researcher sense says no, as long as it's not taking up too much time. It's important for kids to feel a sense of belonging in the world, and showing them who's part of their family could be a profoundly comforting and rooting experience.
FWIW - we used to do this all the time and it was hard for the kids (ages 5 and 3) to pinpoint an "end time" and they would just beg to keep going and going. Quick fixes: Make a folder in your photos that has one picture of every family member and go through only that folder so the routine is easy for them to understand. Or (the no tech option) use Shutterfly (or similar service) to print a a little book with each family member and his/her name underneath. My littles positively love those board books. It's crazy how quickly a (seemingly) reasonable tech habit morphs into something bigger or becomes a source of tantrums for my kiddos. We keep getting lower and lower tech as we go along...
This is something I noticed with our toddlers. If they are watching something on mom's phone they will stay engrossed basically as long as we let them, regardless of who or what is around them. But if we put the same exact thing on a big TV and make them sit 3-4 meters away from it, often their attention will (eventually) wander away and they'll start playing on the various toys in the room.
My theory was that the phone/tablet device is so close it occupies all of our vision. Plus our eyes are focused on something close to us, so looking at something else requires that momentary refocusing of our lenses. We basically have tunnel vision on the device. But, assuming we're sitting at a normal distance from the TV, there's just a lot more stuff in our peripheral vision and we're not in quite the same zombie-watching state.
This is fascinating. I will have to read through some of these articles - I'm a teacher (1st and 2nd grade) and after we went 1-to-1 devices last year I noticed kids were getting to afternoon and were just fried. Unable to concentrate, whiny, not retaining anything. They acted like I feel when I've had too much phone time - so I tried reducing their interactive tech time to a maximum of 30 minutes a day (still not ideal, I know, but it was something). WOW what a difference! They were way more engaged, complained less, and were able to work through lessons with me again. Too bad I finished my Master's or it would have made a fascinating research project!
My district is also 1 to 1 and I really struggle with how much we’re told to limit paper, printing, book requests, etc bc we’ve “invested so much in technology.”
Yes! Last year I added paper to my school supply list because folks were complaining about printer usage - like, I teach littles. They should NOT be using screens instead of paper for everything! 😐
While I mostly agree with the sentiment here, I would also urge you not to throw the baby out with the bathwater. Yes, in our current digital ecosystem the vast majority of interactivity is "bad" for us--compulsive, addictive, hyperarousing, psychologically manipulative, etc. But that doesn't mean *all* interactivity is bad. There are some important things that interactivity gets us that you don't get in passive media.
'Play' is one of the things that interactive media like videogames offer. It's about creating a space within which to experiment, a sandbox to explore ideas. Of course we should prioritize real world play far above digital play, but it's important to note there are ways to play and explore ideas in videogames that are not possible in the real world. For example, exploring the consequences of being able to rewind time (Braid), or what it feels like to be a flower petal in the wind (Flower). Writers/researchers such as Peter Gray and Jane McGonigal go far more in depth on play.
'Systems thinking' is another important aspect of interactivity. We live in a world increasingly driven by systems so it's more important than ever that the humans we raise up can understand these systems. Videogames and other interactive tools, at their best, let you immerse yourself in these systems, play with them, and really form a fundamental understanding of them. Reading a book about a system, while informative, can't give you that firsthand knowledge of how it really works. This is everything from "how does a city work?" to "why is this particular strain of covid particularly dangerous?"
Again, I agree that most interactive media on the menu these days is pretty deleterious. It's like there's a slot machine strapped to your school desk. But maybe it helps to see interactive media through the lens of being a tool. As with any tool, it helps to know what it is good for. Maybe we've just been using the wrong end of the hammer.
This was fascinating! I’m more relaxed about tv time in our house than you are, but have really avoided individual devices of any kind/gaming/youtube. My kids have to sit and watch a show or movie and agree together on what they will watch. I think it teaches them to be patient and considerate and take turns. During the school year we have no screens during the week and probably 2 hours/day on weekend. Summer is a bit more relaxed but they have plenty of off screen time sailing, swimming, reading and engaging in imaginative play. Loved your book and love you Substack!
Thanks for sharing this! My son is 4 and doesn’t do tablets or smartphones at all, but I’m wondering how to get around this once he starts school? Do you have any advice there, since they seem to unfortunately be so ubiquitous and are classified as a “learning” tool, even in elementary school?
Hi Stephanie. I think about this every fall as my kids head back to public school! I inform all teachers of my approach and ask that they please try to minimize my kids' screen time. Then I request that they not be allowed on the iPad during free time. I realize I have limited control when it comes to school, since I'm choosing to send them there as opposed to homeschooling. That's why it is more important than ever to limit screens at home (which it sounds like you're already doing).
homeschool.
I was homeschooled. I think about this every day.
Thanks for this article- do you consider looking at photos of family as interactive screentime if on a personal device? My 2 year old daughter likes when we look through photos of our family and also some extended family on phone- we narrate and go through who is who. I am wondering if this would also be considered damaging? Or is a lesser issue?
Hi Ashley! My non-researcher sense says no, as long as it's not taking up too much time. It's important for kids to feel a sense of belonging in the world, and showing them who's part of their family could be a profoundly comforting and rooting experience.
FWIW - we used to do this all the time and it was hard for the kids (ages 5 and 3) to pinpoint an "end time" and they would just beg to keep going and going. Quick fixes: Make a folder in your photos that has one picture of every family member and go through only that folder so the routine is easy for them to understand. Or (the no tech option) use Shutterfly (or similar service) to print a a little book with each family member and his/her name underneath. My littles positively love those board books. It's crazy how quickly a (seemingly) reasonable tech habit morphs into something bigger or becomes a source of tantrums for my kiddos. We keep getting lower and lower tech as we go along...